Phil Neal and Roy Evans in Belfast
In a shaded rear enclave of Belfast’s Duke of York pub on a balmy afternoon, Phil Neal and Roy Evans innocuously share a few pints.
They could be any one of the 60-something regulars flitting between the roasting cobbles of the bustling alleyway to the cooler shade indoors.
Unlike the rest of the unflinching patrons however, Roy is a former manager of one of the biggest clubs on Earth, and Phil, while playing for that same team, lifted the European Cup no less than four times.
In comparison, Lionel Messi has only held it thrice.
Roy uses the paradigm of Messi to illustrate just how bountiful Phil’s trophy cabinet is.
“He’s the most decorated player in Liverpool’s history,” says Roy, sipping on a Guinness.
Eight First Division titles, four League Cups, five Charity Shields, four European Cups, a UEFA Cup and a UEFA Super Cup – just to be clear.
Roy has forged his own name into Liverpool folklore himself.
Having had a relatively short-lived playing career at the club, he went on to manage Liverpool FC for four years.
Naturally modest, both men are enjoying having a look around Belfast, complimenting us on how much the city is changing for the better.
Not a shred of arrogance between the pair; engaging and friendly, the pride they have in their team is obvious.
Both are full of banter, but when speak of Liverpool FC they make direct eye contact, holding you in their piercing gaze to ensure you’ve acknowledged their point.
They’re here to promote the theatrical production of The Official Story of Liverpool Football Club, coming to the Odyssey Arena for a three-night run in September.
The play will chart Liverpool’s glorious memories, and darkest days, from the club’s beginnings with Belfast player Elisha Scott, to the current squad under the helmsmanship of Carnlough’s Brendan Rodgers.
Roy explains: “The play charts the highs and the lows, including those horrendous moments in Liverpool’s history, Heysel and Hillsborough.”
An appropriate city to hold the play in, given the provenance of the Belfast connection to the club, Roy acknowledges the special relationship between the two cities.
“There’s always been a great connection between Liverpool FC and players from Northern Ireland.
“There were a lot of players from Northern Ireland who played for Liverpool before me and Roy’s time, and we currently have a young player from here in the squad, Ryan McLoughlin, not to mention Brendan Rodgers.
“The two cities share the same sense of humour and of course that great joint shipbuilding heritage.”
To this day both men still follow Liverpool dutifully. Phil goes to every game of the season, while Roy attends as many as he can.
It would be hard to compare Phil and Roy to many of the footballing superstars of today in terms of loyalty to their club.
Of course, both played for other teams. Phil played for Bolton Wanderers and Northampton town before a long managerial career.
Roy played for and managed Liverpool before moving on to manage Fulham and Swindon Town.
Yet both still love Liverpool, for what it has given to them, rather than what they have given to the club.
Phil remembers his first game for Liverpool, not just as it was his debut, but because he was played out of position.
He laughs: “When I first got my debut in the first Liverpool squad it was at Goodison Park against Everton. I’d always played as a full-back or at right-back.
“I had no idea I was going to be picked until that day, and I was being played at left-back! I can understand now that of they told me the day before the game against our biggest rivals, Everton, my head would have been up my arse!”
Roy adds: “The high point of my career was playing for the first team for the first time. I didn’t play too many first team games for Liverpool, but I’ll always remember that.
“In the end, the pinnacle for any manager is lifting the European Cup. In my time as Liverpool manager we only won the League Cup once, but it was still a great feeling.”
Those were different times to the television-controlled big money days we live in now. There was, as Phil says, a more “social” aspect to the game back then.
Money didn’t have as much of an influence, especially when it came to ticket prices, as he reminisces about a day when Wolverhampton’s Molineux stadium lost out on a few quid…
“Bob Paisley was manger and we were on an away trip to Wolverhampton,” grins Phil.
“We’d finished second in the league the previous season and we needed to win at
Wolves’ old Molineaux stadium.
“Phil Thompson, from Kirkby, was playing that day and his brother, Ian and Owen had come to watch the game. Unfortunately there was problem with tickets being allocated to friends and family of the players.
“One of Phil’s brothers climbed up to one of the small windows on the changing room and shouted in to Phil, asking if Bob Paisley could open the big double doors at the side of the changing room. That way they could run through the changing room, past the showers and onto the terraces without being noticed.
“After rolling his eyes for a bit, Bob decided to open the doors.
“When they swung open, Owen, Ian and what can only be described as half of bloody Kirkby came running in through the doors!”
He continues, in between slugs of lager: “Roy was back rubbing down the legs of Kevin Keegan and John Toshack before the game, just watching everybody flood through.
“After about five minutes, with the door still opened and people coming through, Bob turned to Phil and shouted, ‘Thommo! How many relatives have you f***ing got?’ I’ll never forget that remark!”
For Phil, it was that aforementioned pinnacle of European excellence that for him delivered the passion to go on and win three more European Cups.
“The first time I lifted the European Cup, there was a part of me that said, ‘I don’t want to be in UEFA anymore. It was a beautiful moment.
“As you know it’s far easier to qualify for the European Cup today. When we won it back then you had to win the league in order to qualify.
“After that first win we got a hunger for success. There’s that drive that’s within you from then on, once you’ve tasted it.”
Having qualified for this year’s Champions League, that potential for European dominance, once exercised so frequently by Liverpool teams, no less than the 2005 squad which took the trophy in Istanbul in a fashion that will forever live in Liverpool lore, now rests on the shoulders of Brendan Rodgers.
“The great thing about Brendan is that he gives everyone in the squad a chance,” says Roy. “He showed last year what he can do. Brendan has brought us out of the dusty cupboard.”
Phil adds: “Now, the honeymoon period is over for him. The fans won’t settle for less as he is established at Liverpool football club.
“There will be a lot more pressure on him this year with the Champion’s League. I think he felt the pressure towards the end of last season.”
Roy smiles: “He’s very meticulous. His theory about football suits the Liverpool way.
“Hopefully in ten years time, we’ll be seeing an updated version of the Official Liverpool play charting Brendan’s success.”